Maybe you’ll get thrown one of those “hot potatoes” this Memorial Day Weekend. It may be about politics, sex, or the exclusivity of Christianity. We must learn to answer truthfully and with “gentleness and respect.” Satan loves to make our tempers flare to feed the belief that Christians are hateful.
We’ll see truthfulness and love modeled first by Tim Keller and then by Rosaria Butterfield. Both segments are short. Lord, please help us be the winsome and truthful ambassadors you call us to be!
Sunday:
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week?
Monday: Two Opposite Mistakes
Watch up to 2:45 and stop to answer the questions below.
I found it interesting that Keller backed away from answering this question for all churches. That’s because some churches endorse the practice of homosexuality (licentiousness) and some have a whole list of sins that will keep you out of heaven (legalism). Tertullion, an ancient church father, said that Jesus is ever crucified between the thieves of licentiousness and legalism. Keller brings it back to the gospel with truth and love.
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
Tuesday: More Clarification
Listen to the end of the Keller video and then answer.
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, “Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven?
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they thenselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this?
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing?
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell?
Wednesday: Bringing It Back To The Gospel
What I was struck by in listening to Keller all 3 weeks is that he keeps bringing it back to the gospel. When asked about hell, he said it is the rejection of Christ’s sacrifice that causes us to choose hell. When asked about suffering, he brought it back to how Christ suffered on the cross, so we know the answer can’t be that He doesn’t love us. When asked about whether homosexuals are going to hell, he says that isn’t what sends someone to hell, but rejecting Christ’s payment on the cross sends you to hell. I want to learn from this model. You will see Rosaria doing the same thing, for she says a far more serious sin than practicing homosexuality is rejecting Christ. It’s an art to bring it back to the gospel. I’m going to see if you can do that with the three questions we’ve had so far, with clarity and kindness. Answer, bringing it back to the gospel.
8. How can a loving God send people to hell?
9. If God is good, why is there so much suffering in the world?
10. What do Christians have against homosexuality? (Then his follow-up question was, “Are homosexuals going to hell?”
11. Why does Keller say that it isn’t various kinds of sin that send you to hell, but rather, rejection of Christ? What thoughts do you have about this?
Thursday: Rosaria Butterfield
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12. Listen up to 4:22 and answer:
A. Why does Butterfield say we shouldn’t assume homosexuality is our gay friend’s greatest sin?
B. How was she won to the Lord? What can you learn from this?
C. She uses the term “duck and cover” which I had to look up, a term developed when they taught schoolchildren to hide under their desks should there be an atom bomb. Pretty ineffective! She says we mustn’t try to hide from answering the questions, for that is ineffective. I have often avoided the topic, even when someone has hinted at it. I’m learning here and asking God to help me be loving and truthful. Have you had conversations about this that were both loving and truthful? What was said and what happened?
D. Have you shown hospitality to gays? Love? If so, how?
Friday: Rosaria Part II.
13. Listen to the end and share the wisdom she has for parents of a gay child.
14. What wisdom does she have for church leaders?
15. How does she balance truth and love?
Saturday:
16. What is your take-a-way and why?
94 comments
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week?
Wow! What a rough time of year this is for me. Closing school, school activities both for me and the family, and then “life” as well. It has rained and rained and rained and is cold, cold, cold. I really dislike the spring in the NE. I can’t wait to be warm again!
With all of that, I asked my family to host a visit from my former geology professor from long ago. He was visiting the NE and agreed to come see me. I was a bit stressed, wondering how it would go…I hadn’t seen him in nearly 40 yrs! My goal was to know if he knew Jesus. I knew it would be hard to just bring this up, so I planned to mention that our family is taking a mission trip to Belize next February. He is a world famous volcanologist and I wondered about volcanoes there. I did bring up the trip, but I failed in my goal 😔. It is hard, in those moments, to ask such (potentially) difficult questions; “do you know Jesus?” I am trying not to be hard on myself, because I now have established the relationship and can move on from there. God knows my heart. I think His part in it was a fairly calm visit that was memorable. We had a small “reception” at our house that was nice, I took him to a local outdoor exhibit called “Americas Stonehenge,” where ancient people built and lived, and the Underground Railroad occurred. He spoke to 3 of my classes about volcanoes. That was so interesting, as his belief of the most dangerous volcano in the world is Taal in The Philippines (Bing!) and I have a student who has family there and just got back from that very place, just south of Manila! There are so many people (40 million) there. That’s why he says it’s so dangerous. It erupted in 21, 22, 23, and 24. Keep you eyes on that one! We went to a cover band of “The Beatles” on Thursday night. He enjoyed it all.
Thank You Lord for keeping me sane! I must remember he is involved in all the little things too!
I’m sure your classes found that interesting and he enjoyed it too. Lord, please do what You want with this!
I’m sure your classes found that interesting and he enjoyed it too. Lord, please do what You want with this!
Laura, sounds like you have had quite an enjoyable time with your former geology professor. I had to read up on Taal and other volcanoes in the Philippines! We have 25 active ones (yikes) and one of them is in my home province of Negros Occidental(Kanlaon). It erupted one time when we were in the Philippines last summer and again this month!
I echo Dee’s prayers for God to use this time you had with your professor as He deems fit. You are a link to His sovereign will in the life of your professor.
I love your sweet heart of care for your former geology professor, Laura, and I marvel at how God is so much in the details. You never know how God can use the door you merely opened. I hope you get a little rest this summer.
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
Some churches are self righteous in their following, what they believe to be truth, the scriptures about homosexuality.
Homosexuality is not God’s original design for sexuality.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
Humans loved themselves more than God. They did not consider Him in their lives at all.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
Greed leads to these other sins.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
Some churches are ignoring the places in the Bible that address homosexuality.
The Gospel teaches us to love our neighbor. That includes Hindi, Muslim, and gays.
The story of the Good Samaritan shows love for someone just because they are a human being. One without any labels. Jews were not supposed to even be near Samaritans. Yet, the story tells of others bypassing the Jew who was injured (including a holy man!), yet the Samaritan is the one who stops and helps.
I have tried to model this for our family. I have told them I do not believe in being gay, as everything God makes is perfect. I believe those who think they are gay are molded by our fallen world and these characteristics are amplified. Case in point…my dad was a musician. He wasn’t gay and he wasn’t an athlete. We have lost the “Renaissance Man” in our society. I will never treat any human (consciously) differently, because God made them. I don’t have to agree with them and I don’t have to spend loads of time with them. I accept them and live them like anyone else.
Dear Laura, You are building a great relationship with your former professor. I pray that the Lord will continue to grow your friendship. God has a plan and just being your lovely and welcoming self, planted a seed in his heart, I am sure.
Laura! I love this. How fun and brave of you to invite this man to your home and to speak in your classroom, along with entertaining him in your town. I must say, he will remember being in your home and your hospitality and the light of Christ in you. And as you say, now you can build this relationship- a perfect start.
Oh yes, brave…and this speaks to this week’s lesson, kind of….
He is totally different, politically speaking, from me. He teaches still at UC Berkeley! Lol!
😳😅
Sunday:
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week?
I had several things on my calendar that were cancelled due to people’s changes in schedule. Instead of getting irritated, disappointed, or impatient with the other person, I sensed God’s work in continually renewing my mind and attitude. He is teaching me to see things from His perspective, recall the truth, and not worry. It is very freeing.
I am looking forward to the discussion here! Truth and love on this hot topic!
I love how God is freeing your mind, dear Bing. He is teaching me too, though I’m such a special education student and very slow to grasp what He is teaching me.
Missy! I’m also very slow to learn! I love that line…
Yes! Seeing from His perspective.
I just wanted to mention that I heard such a good sermon, as always, from Parkside Church, with Alistair Begg today on the subject of why God allows suffering and how He is actively involved in all the behind the scenes details surrounding the suffering. He always has our good in mind and is working towards that end. I thought it tied so well to our blog topic last week. Even though I may not comment much lately, I’m following with my heart and so long to participate more fully. Daily life is very hard for me and I see no end in sight for relief of these massive burdens. God knows and is helping me to lean on Him.
Incidentally, our blog topic this week sure brings back memories of Alistair Begg and the controversy regarding his counsel to a woman regarding her homosexual grandson’s wedding. I found his response to the conflict to be enlightening and full of grace, highlighting the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can find his response on You Tube as he gives a sermon on the Good Samaritan. I intend to listen again soon.
I think the topic this week is so relevant to our world today. None of us are exempt from contact with homosexuals. This topic is timely for I also believe the Church has so misrepresented Christ in our dealings with our neighbors, co-workers, etc. God help us, help me, to be Gospel-centered and clothed with humility. When my foster son came to confront me several weeks ago as I mentioned then, his greatest problem with me was that I took him to a church which preached against homosexuality and this caused great anguish for him for many many years ((more than 35). I actually do not believe my church at the time was unloving or even emphasized such teaching, but I do believe the Scripture teaching caused conviction whether it was emphasized or not. I was able to tell him with tears that I love him and that I was a sinner saved only by grace. I specifically told him that homosexuality will not send him to Hell (which he said he did not believe in such a place anyway), but only the rejection of the sacrifice of Jesus for sin will bar us from Heaven. Even though I hugged him and cried and said I loved him, it is evident that only the Spirit of God can convict of the sin of not believing in Jesus. This can only be brought about by prayer, so I have my assignment clearly.
Thank you for these three meaningful questions which are so relevant and useful for us to study and get a grip on the hope that is within us. I am learning more and more how very much I need Him and that without Him I can do nothing. I so much want to wear His clothes well.
Thank
Oh dear Miriam, you are such an encouragement to me. I agree completely with you on Alistair and was horrified at how many Christians reacted. Thank you — I’d like to find him on you tube. I understand hundreds of radio stations barred him.
https://youtu.be/t2bmFuA40T4?si=OEcGXuuwa6GDM0lR
This is the sermon with his response to the controversy. I like the title as it relates to our topic this week: compassion versus condemnation.
I so appreciate your comments and pray now for you and your son. These are hard times in our culture with regard to homosexuality and I respect that you are able to show your son love while holding firm to the truth. This is one thing that I discussed recently with a friend who wishes her husband would be more forthright about the truth with their grown children, but she finds he is stronger on the side of love and weak on truth. My husband tends to be stronger on truth. It is tough to find that balance at times. Praying for our group this week as we learn more about grace and truth with these topics of suffering and homosexuality.
So good to see you here, Missy. I love your post and I loved the sermon by Alistar Begg. Thank you for sharing it. It is sad and disappointing how the Christian community can react to things. I will keep your sweet foster son in my prayers. Our world needs Jesus! Our world needs grace.
Sunday:
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week?
I was able to meet with my prayer partners this week and enjoy a sweet time of fellowship with them. We share our burdens and joys once a month and encourage one another with a simple devotion and prayer time. We have been meeting for probably 15 years like this and it has been such joy to support one another and see the way the Lord has answered prayers in relationships as we pray for our families and children.
What a treasure in this prayer group, Chris! I love this!
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
I messed up and posted this into a reply. Sorry for the repeat!
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality? Some churches are self righteous in their following, what they believe to be truth, the scriptures about homosexuality. Homosexuality is not God’s original design for sexuality. 3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ. A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21? Humans loved themselves more than God. They did not consider Him in their lives at all. B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6? Greed leads to these other sins. 4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?Some churches are ignoring the places in the Bible that address homosexuality. The Gospel teaches us to love our neighbor. That includes Hindi, Muslim, and gays. The story of the Good Samaritan shows love for someone just because they are a human being. One without any labels. Jews were not supposed to even be near Samaritans. Yet, the story tells of others bypassing the Jew who was injured (including a holy man!), yet the Samaritan is the one who stops and helps. I have tried to model this for our family. I have told them I do not believe in being gay, as everything God makes is perfect. I believe those who think they are gay are molded by our fallen world and these characteristics are amplified. Case in point…my dad was a musician. He wasn’t gay and he wasn’t an athlete. We have lost the “Renaissance Man” in our society. I will never treat any human (consciously) differently, because God made them. I don’t have to agree with them and I don’t have to spend loads of time with them. I accept them and live them like anyone else.
I like the point about your dad.
Monday
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality? The wrong approach is to ignore what the Bible says about homosexuality in order to love your homosexual neighbor. Keller says homosexuality is not God’s original design for sexuality.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21? Romans 1:20 says God’s eternal power and divine nature are in creation, so when men reject this, we reject him.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6? When we reject God, we are not content and seek all kinds of evil.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point? Being self-righteous in their attitude towards other sinners. Homosexuality is not good for human flourishing, but does not send you to hell. Only rejecting Christ sends you to hell-being your own savior in a way that leads to self-righteousness. The Good Samaritan parable teaches us to love our neighbor. Loving homosexuals, idolaters, etc., is required of Christians. I love when Keller says to the question, does homosexuality send you to hell, no, and heterosexuality doesn’t send you to heaven.
In addition, adding that homesexuality (and all sin!) does not glorify God. I find it a bit lame to only say sin does not help humans flourish.
This is so good, Chris! Sin does not glorify God! Golden! So simple and true! Thank you for adding this comment!
Would love to have you elaborate on this Chris. I feel like it is a gentler way to address sin, so I want to hear your thoughts for I respect you.
Hmm. I guess after I made this comment, I thought about how TK is speaking to an atheist and so he likely used human flourishing as his argument in order to appeal to this mindset, but as Christians our greatest offense in sin is always against God. This particular question in the video was addressing whether homosexuality was a sin and did it send you to hell. It may be a good addition to the discussion to talk about how all sin offends God and separates us from him and only what Christ did on the cross can bring us back to a right relationship with God. Only the Holy Spirit can help a person see this and I’m not sure this man wants to see it.
Looking forward to seeing what God has for you to say
Our own Missy found this rebuttal from Alistair Begg over the firestorm that erupted when he advised a grieving grandmother on what to do about her grand-daughter’s wedding to a transgender individual. I was so grieved at the hateful response from Christians. I’d love you all to watch 4 minutes of the from 14:16 to 18:17 and comment:
MAY 26, 2025
https://youtu.be/t2bmFuA40T4?si=OEcGXuuwa6GDM0lR
Okay. I’ll go first. I admit that this is a tough thought process as we know there is great pressure from culture and community. I love Alistair’s focus on working out your OWN salvation with fear and trembling. I admit in the past at first thought, I had always said attending a wedding is celebrating with those making a commitment to one another and I could not celebrate a commitment that I felt dishonored God and would not be able to attend a wedding of same genders. However, upon reflection, and understanding the circumstances of a relative in this place and wanting to maintain relationship (and as has been discussed here, be the Good Samaritan), I can see where each one would need to work out the details in prayer. My adult daughter has two men in her friend group who are struggling mightily with same sex attraction and how to reconcile this in their lives having grown up in religious west Michigan, where we have a church on every corner. These boys were brought up in a faith community and are torn apart at having this terrible time with identity and how to proceed with their faith. There are many about us dealing with this and no wonder the suicide rate is high, when there are little to none in the church who support them in their plight. I’m so happy to say our church has a class for men struggling with pornography, but what about men struggling with same sex attraction? What about women? We all know they are out there. Most of us know at least one personally. What about a class for those of us who know someone and do not have a clear biblical response for them? As Rosaria Butterfield says, duck and cover is not an acceptable response. We must face this and contend with it in a biblical manner. We must love our neighbors and yet as she says, have boundaries as laid out in our faith. Respect the created order, but love our fellow man and draw him to us with the light of Christ. The difficulty lies in not understanding the situation. We see this sin and do not understand how it is possible because it is not our sin. As Keller says, greed is spoken against 10x more in the Bible. Should we all not consider our own sin first? And then have great compassion on those with this most dreadful mix up of same sex attraction, which attacks ones own identity more than any other sin? Everyone of us faces sin and yet most sins we feel we can set ourselves apart from- I am a liar, I can stop lying. I am greedy, I will give to the poor. But I am same sex attracted, what? I am my own sin. How does one escape this, except by the grace of God? And truly, if we admit it, all sin is only escapable by the grace of God. May we all have great compassion and love for those with this struggle and pray much before making any decision as to how to respond if we are invited into their lives.
How I love your thoughtful answer, Chris. Neither legalism nor licentiousness here, but thoughtful pondering and wrestling. There may not be one answer fits all, as neat and tidy as that would be!
Yes, it is not neat and tidy. Trust me!
Oh, Chris! I love this honest and thoughtful response! Everything you wrote is so meaningful! I have had many gay male friends in my life. I worked with interior designers and artists for many years. They are all wonderful and talented people and are all dear friends. I have known three that came out of that lifestyle and two became Christians. As you said, it is only with the grace of God that any of us can conquer our struggles, what ever they may be. We know that the evil one, sends temptations our way every day.
Patti — I love this testimony.
Monday: Two Opposite Mistakes
Watch up to 2:45 and stop to answer the questions below.
I found it interesting that Keller backed away from answering this question for all churches. That’s because some churches endorse the practice of homosexuality (licentiousness) and some have a whole list of sins that will keep you out of heaven (legalism). Tertullion, an ancient church father, said that Jesus is ever crucified between the thieves of licentiousness and legalism. Keller brings it back to the gospel with truth and love.
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
The first wrong approach is assuming all churches agree on the answer.
It isn’t God’s original design for sexuality.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
People knew God because of everything He made, being able to see His invisible qualities, eternal power and divine nature and not having any excuse. But, they wouldn’t worship Him or even give Him thanks. So instead they thought up foolish ideas about God which resulted in their minds becoming dark and confused.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
It leads to worshiping the things of this world…sexual immortality, lust, impurity, lust, evil desires and greediness.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
Singling out gay people in a self-righteous way.
We’re to love our neighbors no matter their faith, lifestyles etc.
I liked your “first wrong answer is assuming all churches have the same response.”
Tuesday: More Clarification
Listen to the end of the Keller video and then answer.
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, “Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven? Denying Christ.
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they thenselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this? He speaks about greed being spoken against in the Bible 10x more than homosexuality. This is wise as there are not any who are not touched by greed and it levels the playing field a bit, so to speak. What this man needed to hear was that homosexuality does not send you to hell, as greed does not send you to hell.
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing? Both practices are not good for us-these practices hurt those we love when committed.
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell? The sin under the sin sends us to hell. You can’t be your own savior through your own good works. Moralism, being proud and our own savior, is what sends us to hell. God will not send us to heaven because we are good, but many believe this.
Sunday:
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week?
—Ok, I’m back and trying to figure out how to jump back in after several weeks of not being involved. I certainly didn’t intend to be absent. It pretty much has been a time issue along with traveling but the topic of Hard questions very much interest me. Especially last week’s on suffering. I will share more on that later in regard to my close friend Lynda whose ongoing physical suffering has been intense. I even spent time with her in the ER recently.
I have spent some time this morning reading back over comments and listening to Keller. I certainly have been blessed by that.
The question of experiencing the goodness of God in the last week is always hard to narrow down for me. Every single day He pours some kind of goodness into my life even when life is tough. The knowledge of his love and presence carries me through each day. I am deeply grateful to know He never ever leaves or forsakes me in spite of me.
But to narrow it down to one thing would be that my son Tyce is in India with 3 other men meeting with native Indian pastors associated with The Fellowship of Berean Churches that Tyce is now president of. Having him in a country that is hostile to Christianity and recently was in a declared war with Pakistan was challenging to my heart. But God in his goodness has given me a very real peace and it has come through my daily Bible reading and prayer time.
Tyce reports back that the time there with those pastors has been very productive. Most of those men have at some point literally been physically beaten for their faith in Christ.
Please pray for him as he and his team start back today on their 24 hour trek of travel to come home.
So good to have you back, Bev. I will pray for safe travels and good connections for Tyce.
Bev, you encourage me tonight with your comments about God being with us every moment. I am so very discouraged in my life right now. I need to hear this. Everything seems to be going wrong. Thank you for your post. I will pray for Tyce.
Father, I lift up Tyce to you. Thank You for his heart, and please protect him and help me be a light in such darkness. Thank you for the peace you’ve given Bev, and may it continue.
My prayers for Tyce and his team continue. Please let us know when he is home. Praying for the Lord’s protection and safe travels for all of them.
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
Eisenbach is assuming most churches have something against homosexuals. Tim Keller always has a kind and humorous way of getting back to the gospel. The Bible says that homosexuality is not God’s original design for human sexuality. It does not help human beings flourish.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
Since creation, God has demonstrated that He is God through the natural order and His creation. Man had continually turned against God’s ways and His gifts, and turned to his own desires and his idols. We humans are so easily deceived by our righteous good works, while we rule our own lives, instead of asking Jesus in to help us live by His rules. Self righteousness is the sin beneath the sin, thinking that you can be your own savior. We need to to have a relationship with Jesus.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6
Without Jesus, we are vulnerable to the sins of immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire and greed. When we thrive on disobeying God’s laws, thinking we know better than He does what is good for us, we are setting ourselves up for His wrath. With Jesus, we have a Shepherd and a Savior, who will send the Holy Spirit to guide our conscience to follow God’s ways.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
The wrong approach is to oppress homosexuals. We are all God’s children and we are called to love and care for others. It does not say we are to promote ideas that are sinful. We need to separate the sin from the person. I also think the churches must be cautious not to promote sin. It can be a fine line.
Tuesday: More Clarification
Listen to the end of the Keller video and then answer.
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, “Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven?
The point he’s making is that you can’t go to heaven by just being a good person.
Rejecting Christ.
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they themselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this?
He points out that Jesus talks about the sin of greed 10x more than adultery.
This is a sin that one may not realize they’re doing or want to admit they’re guilty of. There are many sins that Christians are committing but they don’t sent them to hell. This is a wise way to introduce the Gospel into the conversation.
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing?
If we’re greedy then how are we helping those in need and being able to flourish?
Homosexuality will keep humanity from flourishing.
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell?
The sin underneath the sin…”I am my own savior and lord.”
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, “Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven?
The only way to heaven is to know and accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior. Not believing in Him will keep you out of heaven.
Monday: Two Opposite Mistakes
Watch up to 2:45 and stop to answer the questions below.
I found it interesting that Keller backed away from answering this question for all churches. That’s because some churches endorse the practice of homosexuality (licentiousness) and some have a whole list of sins that will keep you out of heaven (legalism). Tertullion, an ancient church father, said that Jesus is ever crucified between the thieves of licentiousness and legalism. Keller brings it back to the gospel with truth and love.
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question? What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
Some Christians avoid what the Bible says about homosexuality to love their gay neighbor.
I love how Tim Keller handled this by establishing his stand that he is going to talk about his church and not represent all churches in the world. (Humor again!) He stated his first belief that the Bible says homosexuality is not God’s ordained design for human sexuality. But it also says to love your neighbor.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
Suppressing the truth and the rejection of God for who He is.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
It is giving in to your earthly nature, the love of self, or the idol of self.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
Some Christians take what the Bible says about homosexuality seriously, but in a self-righteous way, singling out gay people. They would love their Muslim and Hindu neighbors, but not love their gay neighbors. The Good Samaritan parable talks about how a priest, a Levite, and a Samaritan responded to the hurt (their neighbor) man. The priest and the Levite did not care for the man because of the law ( do not touch, uncleanness, uncaring). Similarly, Christians can do the same and be selective in their definition of a “neighbor”.
1. How have you experienced the goodness of God in the last week? I’ve missed so much!! What great topics to cover!!
I’ve experienced the goodness of God this week, even in the searing pain I’m going through right now. I’m reviewing all my old bible memory verses, and not just reviewing which is easy to do, but meditating. Gal 2:20 really stood out so I stopped and meditated.. Sometimes it’s easy to forget when the pain of suffering hits that I have been crucified with Christ..and I no longer live but Christ lives in me. I just want him to take the pain away. So absorbing the wonder of the Gospel and the hope of the future! In those moments of intimacy with God-the pain subsides but even if the pain remains, He’s strengthening me. The Psalms have been really good for me in this season too.
Hi Rebecca! So nice to see you here.
I have missed your posts, Rebecca. God is Good!
Rebecca — good to see you here. You’ve made some hard but I think very healthy choices and we’d love to support you here!
Yes! Rebecca! We would love to support you in any way we can. ♥️🙏
Love to see you back. Sorry to hear of your pain, but glad to hear of His strengthening you. 🤍
I listened to the Alistair Beggs rebuttal. I have a bard time with this. I suppose he is right, but I see it a bit differently. I think the grandmother going is a blessing over the wedding and the homosexual lifestyle. Why can’t you just have a good relationship with the grandson but hold a line that is respectful to yourself also? Your views count too! You can be kind with people but not agree with them.
My son actually asked me if I would go to a “wedding” (weddings are between a man and a woman since God created marriage) if he were to “marry” another man. I love my son and I am kind to him. We have a good relationship. He actually lives with us right now. I have told him that I could not attend because I can’t condone a relationship like that, that isn’t natural. I don’t say I think he will go to hell. I have thought it before though. Tim Keller has set me straight now. I guess if you haven’t been in the situation with your own family member, you can’t feel the pain. I don’t think he believes in God now either. He went to a private Christian high school! I wish I had never sent him there! They obviously taught him that it was okay to be gay. He never was that way prior to going to that school. $40,000 spent and he came out like that! So, I will love him but I won’t condone the behavior. I’m sad that he doesn’t believe in God now.
Such a hard place to be in Laura. I like that you have your son with you. This shows your support and love for HIM. And I love that you have set boundaries with regard to your beliefs. I believe each situation needs to be carefully prayed over and treated individually. Sounds like you are on the right path. Praying now for your son to turn to the Lord and for you to see how to help him in this. ❤️
Thank you Chris. I appreciate your kind words and your prayers. Life on Earth is hard. I want to honor the scriptures. It says that it is wrong to live that way, but it also says we should love one another. I am trying to balance both.
It is a hard balancing acts between love and truth and one size does not fit all. That is so sad about the Christian school. I’m sure your son knows you love him.
That is a difficult situation, Laura. Life on this earth is so challenging. I join Chris in praying for you and your son.
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they thenselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this?
He says that greed is worse. It is wise because it draws the attention to others and off the focus of someone else’s sin, but rather the pointing to our own sin. Like Jesus says about the log in our own eye.
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing?
All sin hurts us and keeps us from being who God wants us to be as Christians. However, it is expected because we are human.
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell?
Self-righteousness, thinking you can save yourself, will send you to hell. We need to know we are a sinner, saved by grace, and that we need Jesus to help us.
Monday: Two Opposite Mistakes
2. What is the first wrong approach to this question?
—The wrong approach is thinking a gay person goes to hell for being homosexual.
What reason does Keller give for God standing against the practice of homosexuality?
—Homosexuality is not God’s design for human sexuality as outlined in the Bible. God’s Word makes that clear.
3. The sin beneath any sin is idolatry, or worshipping something other than God. Another way to put it is that the only sin that will keep you out of heaven is a rejection of Christ.
A. How can you see this sin beneath the sin in Romans 1:18-21?
—God is not hidden to mankind. God has made the truth about Himself obvious to people. They can see Him through everything he has made, through his invisible qualities and his eternal power and divine nature. The sin is based in their suppressing truth by wickedness and ultimately is in mankind’s refusal to worship God.
B. How can you see idolatry, or rejecting God, leading to all kinds of sins on the basis of Colossians 3:5-6?
—Worshipping the things of the world instead of God leads to the sins listed such as sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed.
4. What is the other wrong approach churches and Christians have made? How does Jesus’ parable of the Good Samaritan illustrate Keller’s point?
—They have made choices about who they will love as their “neighbor” and singled out homosexuality as a reason to not love certain neighbors them making unforgivable. Churches and people have been pharisaical about homosexuals like the Levite and the Priest in the story of the good Samaritan but the Samaritan completely set aside any prejudice against his neighbor and demonstrated love for the broken and beaten man and cared for him in spite of who and what he was. That is the example of Christ. He accepts all sinners who will come to Him.
Tuesday: More Clarification
Listen to the end of the Keller video and then answer.
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, “Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven?
—The only sin which keeps you out of Heaven is rejecting Christ and His payment for sin on the Cross. Refusing to bow our knee (our hearts) to God and his plan for salvation.
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they thenselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this?
—Keller points out greed as an example of sin that is often mentioned by the Bible which people practice and is no less condemned by God than other sins including homosexuality. The bottom line is that we gave a heart issue of wanting what we want which goes against God’s stated standard for practicing his righteousness. Godliness is the practice of living a holy life that fosters human flourishing.
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing?
—Greed is all about self consumption and ignoring and providing for the needs of others.
Homosexuality is also a self focused sin based in one’s feelings of trying to satisfy oneself apart from God’s plan for the flourishing of mankind.
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell?
—the sin that sends someone to Hell is trying to be their own lord and savior and refusing to accept Jesus Christ as the one and only Lord & Savior.
Good to have our wise Bev back!
Love all of your post, Bev. I especially like your reference in 7 about sin being self focused! So true !
Bev, on 7 I SO agree with you! I remember taking our kids to Salem, Mass when we first moved here. There were 2 women holding hands and I thought to myself, “How can they do that in front of children?” I didn’t want my kids exposed to it. But, it didn’t matter to them. It is all about how they feel, not about how I feel. I’ve always thought homosexual people are quite consumed with themselves and unconcerned about how it makes others feel.
Wednesday: Bringing It Back To The Gospel
What I was struck by in listening to Keller all 3 weeks is that he keeps bringing it back to the gospel. When asked about hell, he said it is the rejection of Christ’s sacrifice that causes us to choose hell. When asked about suffering, he brought it back to how Christ suffered on the cross, so we know the answer can’t be that He doesn’t love us. When asked about whether homosexuals are going to hell, he says that isn’t what sends someone to hell, but rejecting Christ’s payment on the cross sends you to hell. I want to learn from this model. You will see Rosaria doing the same thing, for she says a far more serious sin than practicing homosexuality is rejecting Christ. It’s an art to bring it back to the gospel. I’m going to see if you can do that with the three questions we’ve had so far, with clarity and kindness. Answer, bringing it back to the gospel.
8. How can a loving God send people to hell?
A loving God doesn’t sent people to hell as that is a choice but He gave you another choice… to believe on His only Son, Jesus who died on the cross so you could have eternal life with Him in heaven
9. If God is good, why is there so much suffering in the world?
I can’t tell you why there is so much suffering in the world, but I can tell you that God loved you so much that He sent His only Son into the world to suffer and die on the cross for you.
10. What do Christians have against homosexuality? (Then his follow-up question was, “Are homosexuals going to hell?”
The Bible teaches that homosexuality is a sin, just like greed, immorality, lust, gossip and others, but those sins aren’t what send people to hell but rather rejecting Jesus Christ who died on the cross for sin so that we could be made right with God.
11. Why does Keller say that it isn’t various kinds of sin that send you to hell, but rather, rejection of Christ? What thoughts do you have about this?
Your sins don’t sent you to hell, just as not sinning sends you to heaven. I think this gets to heart of the gospel and is a very good response in opening the door to that conversation.
Beautifully done, as usual!
8. How can a loving God send people to hell?
He sent His own Son to hell to save us.
9. If God is good, why is there so much suffering in the world?
Jesus suffered on the cross.
10. What do Christians have against homosexuality? (Then his follow-up question was, “Are homosexuals going to hell?”
You can’t ignore the scriptures which say both homosexuality and greed are sinful.
The only way to avoid hell is to believe that Jesus is Lord and Savior.
11. Why does Keller say that it isn’t various kinds of sin that send you to hell, but rather, rejection of Christ? What thoughts do you have about this?
The only way to heaven is through Christ. This is what the Bible says. if you accept Christ, then you accept trying to be more Christ like. Christ was not greedy nor was he gay.
That’s a “Laura spin” on the last answer. I like it, though I might add none of us will be perfect until we see Jesus face to face. You always bring something for us to think about!
12. Listen up to 4:22 and answer:
A. Why does Butterfield say we shouldn’t assume homosexuality is our gay friend’s greatest sin?
Because unbelief in Jesus is a greater sin and that is where we should begin with homosexuals.
B. How was she won to the Lord? What can you learn from this?
She developed a relationship with a pastor and his wife. They were her neighbors. Their hospitality won her over! We need to be hospitable!
C. She uses the term “duck and cover” which I had to look up, a term developed when they taught schoolchildren to hide under their desks should there be an atom bomb. Pretty ineffective! She says we mustn’t try to hide from answering the questions, for that is ineffective. I have often avoided the topic, even when someone has hinted at it. I’m learning here and asking God to help me be loving and truthful. Have you had conversations about this that were both loving and truthful? What was said and what happened?
Oh boy, yes I have! I remember once trying to explain to my colleague that it was wrong to allow her teen daughter to become a boy. All the chemicals and such! I tried so hard to explain why Jesus died for us and our sin. It happened to be around Easter. Her comment was that Jesus accepts everyone but not gays. She is an atheist. Raised Catholic, I believe, and more legalistic. I was not effective at all! After that, we remained “cool” friends. The daughter has changed herself into a boy/man and I see her sometimes. I am always cordial, but my colleague and I are estranged. She left the school and we don’t keep in touch anymore. Who knows if I planted a seed 🤷🏻♀️.
I have told our son, years ago, that God makes perfection and he is perfectly made, and not gay. I would never believe otherwise.
D. Have you shown hospitality to gays? Love? If so, how?
I remember, in college, I had a gay friend. His name was Kent. He worked with me at a restaurant waiting tables. He was older and not in college. I didn’t really know much about gays back then. I was raised in a Christian family in the Deep South! He and I just had fun together waiting tables. I used to have some name for him (?) that was basically something about being “buff.” He was “jacked up” with muscles! That’s how the gay men are for some reason. He called me “Morganna.” She was a voluptuous, blonde who used to run across Major League Baseball fields! Haha! We had this friendly, funny relationship. I didn’t really know he was gay until later in our friendship. He died of aids back in the nineties. I loved him. It didn’t matter that he was gay, to me. I was not a practicing Christian back then either. My parents taught me to be respectful and kind to all. Thank You Lord. Thank You for giving me good upbringing. I’m so sorry if I have hurt people. I never meant to.
I mentioned our youngest son, above. He lives with us. I have always been kind and loving to him. However, I also have told him that I don’t believe he is gay and that I don’t agree with the behavior of being gay. It’s the boundary I have set with him. Right now he accepts that, but mainly because he knows he needs us to survive. He also knows I love him.
I once had a gay boss. I treated him exactly as I would treat a straight boss. I didn’t go to his “wedding” shower however. I didn’t even contribute money or sign the card. Should I have? Probably, according to Alistair Beggs. But, it was honoring myself (again, the boundary) and not ignoring my faith and scripture. I don’t have to be in agreement with them but I can treat them well.
I love your stories.
I don’t believe Alistair was saying you should always go to those events, but to ask the Lord what would be the response that would most likely bring them closer to the Lord. In that situation he felt it important for the grandmother to keep her connection — that might not always be the case.
Laura, you have touched so many lives. I love the friendship that you had with Kent and with your boss. I love that you assure your son of your constant love. God is Love. Love can change everything. I pray for your son to have an open heart to God.
Laura, I appreciate all you have said here and I think you’re doing a great job with balancing love and truth with your son. I know it isn’t easy but God knows your heart and your son knows you love him. Praying for you, your son and your family as you navigate difficult situations…God cares about every aspect of your life.
Thursday: Rosaria Butterfield
12. Listen up to 4:22 and answer:
A. Why does Butterfield say we shouldn’t assume homosexuality is our gay friend’s greatest sin?
She would start with assuming unbelief is the greatest sin because you will have a soul that will last forever.
B. How was she won to the Lord? What can you learn from this?
Through the friendship with a pastor and his wife who were neighbors. They got to know her and ministered Christ to her in a personal way, knowing what she feared and needed.
Being friendly and hospitable can go a long way to making an impression and building trust.
C. She uses the term “duck and cover” which I had to look up, a term developed when they taught schoolchildren to hide under their desks should there be an atom bomb. Pretty ineffective! She says we mustn’t try to hide from answering the questions, for that is ineffective. I have often avoided the topic, even when someone has hinted at it. I’m learning here and asking God to help me be loving and truthful. Have you had conversations about this that were both loving and truthful? What was said and what happened?
No, I guess you could say I “duck and cover.”
D. Have you shown hospitality to gays? Love? If so, how?
I’ve know a girl since she was in 2nd grade from church, have taught her in Sunday School, VBS, youth group and mentored her one on one when she was in high school. She since has grown up and has been in a few same sex relationships. I had no idea she had any tendencies toward this lifestyle and in teaching and mentoring she knows the gospel and she also knows what the Bible teaches about homosexuality. Every time I see her she always runs up to me and gives me a hug and I sincerely hug her back and tell her I love her. We went camping with her, her brother, my son and grandsons about 2 months ago and had a wonderful time. When we parted ways I received a text from her thanking us for the good time and how much she enjoyed being with us. I responded in same and told her I loved her. Our relationship/friendship has never been strained as I have never judged her but she knows I love her.
What a great testimony in your answer to D!
Oh, Sharon! Love this sweet relationship you have maintained with this girl. This in itself is such a witness for Jesus.
What a sweet friendship you have with the young woman! I love your story.
5. We do laugh when Keller says heterosexuality will not get you into heaven. (Perhaps it would have been clearer had he added, Not even being loving and faithful to a challenging spouse will get you into heaven” ) But what point is he trying to clarify about the only way to heaven? So, therefore, what is the only sin that can keep you out of heaven?
We all sin; no sin is good for your soul. What will keep you out of heaven is Self righteousness, thinking you can be your own Lord and Savior.
6. Now he shows, through illustrations, that Christians can be very judgmental about sexual sin, but blind to less visible sins that they thenselves might be committing. How does he do that? Why might this be wise to do in a discussion like this?
Christians can obsess on a sexual sin, yet turn a blind eye to their own sins of greed, gossip, and other things that are not good for the soul or for human flourishing. Keller points out that the Bible talks about greed more than it talks about adultery. As sin is a sin~ There is not a hierarchy of sin….all sin is sin and it all against God’s laws.
7. How do both the practice of greed and homosexuality hurt human flourishing?
These things become your idols and they override your relationship to Jesus. We need to focus first on our own sin and the need of a relationship with Jesus. Greed and homosexuality are self centered sins and they do nothing to promote our relationship with Jesus.
8. How does Keller close with what sends you to hell?
The sin beneath the sin, self righteousness, moralism; Bible believing Christians, who think God will send them to heaven because they are good. That is not a relationship that depends on God’s grace and forgiveness. It does not acknowledge the price Jesus paid for us.
What I was struck by in listening to Keller all 3 weeks is that he keeps bringing it back to the gospel. When asked about hell, he said it is the rejection of Christ’s sacrifice that causes us to choose hell. When asked about suffering, he brought it back to how Christ suffered on the cross, so we know the answer can’t be that He doesn’t love us. When asked about whether homosexuals are going to hell, he says that isn’t what sends someone to hell, but rejecting Christ’s payment on the cross sends you to hell. I want to learn from this model. You will see Rosaria doing the same thing, for she says a far more serious sin than practicing homosexuality is rejecting Christ. It’s an art to bring it back to the gospel. I’m going to see if you can do that with the three questions we’ve had so far, with clarity and kindness. Answer, bringing it back to the gospel.
8. How can a loving God send people to hell?
Our self righteousness and thinking we can be our own savior are what sends us to hell. God desires us to accept the gift of forgiveness that He sent in His Son, Jesus Christ. It is our choice. It is not our sin, it is our lack of asking forgiveness and having a relationship with Jesus.
9. If God is good, why is there so much suffering in the world?
I do not know or understand why there is so much suffering in the world, but it is not because God does not love us. Evil is the absence of God and good.
10. What do Christians have against homosexuality? (Then his follow-up question was, “Are homosexuals going to hell?”)
I like Keller’s answer that homosexuality is not God’s original plan for human flourishing. It does not promote human flourishing. It is not good for your soul, and does not encourage a deep relationship with Jesus. Homosexuality will not send you to hell. They are so many other sins, like greed, pride, cheating, cruel treatment of others and more. It is rejecting a relationship with Jesus that will head you to hell.
11. Why does Keller say that it isn’t various kinds of sin that send you to hell, but rather, rejection of Christ? What thoughts do you have about this?
It is the sin beneath the sin, the rejection of Christ and His lordship in our lives that can send us to hell. There are many subtle ways to reject Christ, like being centered on self rather than on others. We need a deep and personal relationship with Jesus. It has to be a daily walk and a way of life. We need to focus on doing for others in need and not just ourselves.
I was watching D. C. Carson and Keller on youtube discuss how to approach the question of hell and Keller suggested asking them if they think anyone should go to hell — like Hitler…because that brings up the whole topic of the need for justice and can lead into why Jesus died…
That would be a great lead -in question, Dee!
Friday:
I apologize for not engaging well in answering the questions this week. We have had out of town appointments twice this week so travel time is involved. Also I am part of the Women’s leadership team at church and we are putting on a women’s event at our church tomorrow. And my son returned from a ministry trip to India this week and connecting there has been a priority.
Over the last few weeks a young friend in Christ whom I have had a mentoring role was ready to give up on her marriage. She is a committed Christian who walks closely with our Lord.
But probably the most important thing on my heart, mind and in my prayers is my close friend Lynda. She really hit rock bottom physically, emotionally and spiritually this week. Our interactions have been very important touch points. I started Job in my Bible reading this week. (I don’t like the book of Job.)
But needless to say it has been timely. So even as I have tried to take in and engage with the 3 hard questions and read what has been written I have been living up close and personal with the suffering of others.
Lynda has been suffering with severe physical issues that I can’t begin to outline here. None of which is self induced by lifestyle or unhealthy habits on her part. God has simply allowed them like with Job for His own purposes. I just don’t have time or space to share so much about it here but she would tell you God is still a God of Grace and she is still trusting him and him alone to use it all for for good and for his glory. I keep thinking she can’t be long for this world and death would be a merciful alternative to her situation. She has suffered intense physical pain. Hard as it is we both are committed to trusting Him. Jesus and what he did on the Cross is all that matters to both of us. It truly is the Gospel above all else that makes any sense to suffering. The Cross of Jesus Christ is the touch point for all sin and suffering. As Peter said “…….Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words that give eternal life.” John 6:68
I also have had up close and personal involvement with the issue of homosexuality. So I have great appreciation for Keller’s comments and Rosaria Butterfield’s story. I have read her book and I
also consider Christopher Yuan’s book “Out of A Far Country” a must read on his story and that of his mother’s cowritten by them. He has also written “Holy Sexuality and The Gospel” with a forward by Rosaria Butterfield. Sorry I just don’t have time now to share more. I may try to do that Sunday.
So good to hear that Tyce is safely home. My heart aches for your friend, Lynda. I will pray for her. Life can be very hard and very lonely. Thanking God for who He is!
Bev, thank you for your post. It resonates with me tonight. Our lives are so involved, aren’t they? You are a good friend. I can tell. I am praying for Lynda. I am glad that she is such a believer. I liked Christopher Yuan’s book too. I didn’t know he wrote another. Take care.
Wednesday: Bringing It Back To The Gospel
What I was struck by in listening to Keller all 3 weeks is that he keeps bringing it back to the gospel. When asked about hell, he said it is the rejection of Christ’s sacrifice that causes us to choose hell. When asked about suffering, he brought it back to how Christ suffered on the cross, so we know the answer can’t be that He doesn’t love us. When asked about whether homosexuals are going to hell, he says that isn’t what sends someone to hell, but rejecting Christ’s payment on the cross sends you to hell. I want to learn from this model. You will see Rosaria doing the same thing, for she says a far more serious sin than practicing homosexuality is rejecting Christ. It’s an art to bring it back to the gospel. I’m going to see if you can do that with the three questions we’ve had so far, with clarity and kindness. Answer, bringing it back to the gospel.
8. How can a loving God send people to hell?
He does not send people to hell. People choose it by rejecting what Christ has done on the cross for them. We have the freedom to choose. Jesus paid the penalty for our sins so that we might have eternal life. It is a choice. Do I accept or reject Him?
9. If God is good, why is there so much suffering in the world?
We may not know why God does not stop suffering. But we know it is not because of a lack of love or indifference on His part. Or He would not have sent His Son to come to earth to suffer the penalty of our sins on the cross so we can have eternal life, which we do not deserve.
10. What do Christians have against homosexuality? (Then his follow-up question was, “Are homosexuals going to hell?”
Homosexuality is a sin, just as greed, lying, and envy are sins. These do not send you to hell. Nor good works send you to heaven. Jesus died for the penalty of all these sins. If we do not believe this and reject Him, then we are destined for hell. It is the sin beneath the sin, that is, the rejection of Chris as Lord and Savior, that sends one to hell.
11. Why does Keller say that it isn’t various kinds of sin that send you to hell, but rather, rejection of Christ? What thoughts do you have about this?
These various kinds of sin are just the outward manifestations of the conditions of the heart. Who is seated in the center of my heart? When I am greedy, I reject the claim of Christ to be the Provider of all things. When I hold on to an ungodly relationship, I reject Christ as my Faithful Lover. When I am envious, I reject Christ as Lord over all creation and the giver of all good things.
Dee, I don’t know if I answered this correctly. I could feel the magnitude of the importance of bringing back these hard questions to the gospel. Keller is excellent, and I pray I will always have this principle in mind in future conversations.
I agree, Bing. How I need to bring these hard questions back to the Gospel. Love your comment that these kinds of sin are the outward manifestations of the heart. May my heart turn to the Gospel.🙏
12. Listen up to 4:22 and answer:
A. Why does Butterfield say we shouldn’t assume homosexuality is our gay friend’s greatest sin? Their greatest sin is unbelief.
B. How was she won to the Lord? What can you learn from this?
Pastor Ken Smith and his wife befriended her. They ministered to her in a very specific way. Showing acceptance is different than showing approval. You need to set boundaries. Ken and his wife showed her what a Christian family looked like.
C. She uses the term “duck and cover” which I had to look up, a term developed when they taught schoolchildren to hide under their desks should there be an atom bomb. Pretty ineffective! She says we mustn’t try to hide from answering the questions, for that is ineffective. I have often avoided the topic, even when someone has hinted at it. I’m learning here and asking God to help me be loving and truthful. Have you had conversations about this that were both loving and truthful? What was said and what happened?
I have known and worked for, and worked with many gay guys. They were all wonderful people and helped me greatly in my business, yet we did not address their relationships. I did know most of their partners. I have known gay students at school, but I was not personally in a position to minister to them.
D. Have you shown hospitality to gays? Love? If so, how?
I adored my mentor in college and my clients and artists, who were gay. I only had a business relationship with them, but they knew I was a Christian.
Friday: Rosaria Part II.
13. Listen to the end and share the wisdom she has for parents of a gay child.
Take a deep breath, resolve to love God and your child deeply and well. If your child was raised in a Christian home remember that God’s Word does not return void. Also, remember that heterosexuality is not the solution to homosexuality…I thought this was really good advice because I’ve seen this being the solution (either by the family or person) to prove they have overcome the sin when in fact they really haven’t. She continues to say, “there are people who will struggle with all manner of sin for many years of their life,maybe all their life. These are big crosses to bear but as a church and as a family we shouldn’t add any more weight to that cross.”
14. What wisdom does she have for church leaders?
It’s important to remember that homosexuality is a sin but so is homophobia. Take the kid gloves off and be frank with what conversion is. It’s not belief in Jesus as the demons believed in Jesus and it sent them to hell. Belief and faith are evident through fruit and that fruit is repentance. I think this stands for any sin you may be dealing with in the church. It needs to be confronted and taken care of according to Scripture and in love.
When true conversion and repentance does take place we become new creatures in Christ. Our identity is in Jesus Christ, not our sin. On that note I don’t think there’s such a thing as a “gay” Christian. I would never introduce myself as a “gossiping, adulterous (or any sin you want to put there),” Christian. Not because I may not struggle with any of those, but that’s no longer who I am…I’m now a new creature in Christ.
15. How does she balance truth and love?
See #14
Good reflection. On that note I don’t think there’s such a thing as a “gay” Christian. I would never introduce myself as a “gossiping, adulterous (or any sin you want to put there),” Christian. Not because I may not struggle with any of those, but that’s no longer who I am…I’m now a new creature in Christ. Thank you.
I agree. I think many who identify that way are saying that God accepts the gay lifestye and there are churches that try to justify that scripturally which is a very big twist. They say, for example, that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was inhospitality instead of sexual sin.
When I attended Calvin University, there was a big article in the school magazine interviewing students about how they justified their homosexuality in scripture. This was around 1989. Don’t we all justify our sin at first? We wouldn’t fall into sin if we didn’t listen to the lies of the serpent.
Thursday: Rosaria Butterfield
12. Listen up to 4:22 and answer:
A. Why does Butterfield say we shouldn’t assume homosexuality is our gay friend’s greatest sin?
She considers unbelief to be the greatest sin.
B. How was she won to the Lord? What can you learn from this?
Her neighbor, Kent Smith, and his wife, Gloria, engaged her as a neighbor. He ministered to her in a specific way. There is a difference between acceptance vs approval. I have started reading Rosaria’s “The Gospel has a House Key” book, but have not finished it yet. She described their authentic caring for her.
C. She uses the term “duck and cover” which I had to look up, a term developed when they taught schoolchildren to hide under their desks should there be an atom bomb. Pretty ineffective! She says we mustn’t try to hide from answering the questions, for that is ineffective. I have often avoided the topic, even when someone has hinted at it. I’m learning here and asking God to help me be loving and truthful. Have you had conversations about this that were both loving and truthful? What was said and what happened?
She said we should pray to God for discernment when we are talking to our gay friends. Some of the best health care workers I have worked with the first time I came to the US were gay. They were winsome, very caring, and had excellent nursing skills. I wish I knew what I know now to share the gospel with these friends, but I have lost track of them.
D. Have you shown hospitality to gays? Love? If so, how?
Yes, and to our daughter, Ruth’s closest friends. Sending cards of congratulations for a graduation. At Ruth’s birthday a couple of years ago, she asked me to make Filipino food for her friends. I did, and several of the friends who came were gay. It was good to get to know them and serve them through food. I believe Ruth is still friends with all of them. I haven’t had much conversation with Ruth about this gay lifestyle for a while now. She knows where we stand on the matter. I am praying for an opportunity to talk with her about it again. I am thankful for the conversations here and the enlightenment I am receiving to balance truth and love.
I love what Rosaria said about praying for discernment. I think this corresponds to Alistair Begg’s response to the grandmother, whom he advised to keep her relationship with her granddaughter by attending the latter’s wedding.
Friday: Rosaria Part II.
13. Listen to the end and share the wisdom she has for parents of a gay child.
Hopefully, you have a good relationship with your child before this came to be. Take a deep breath, love God, and love your child well. If you have faith in God and raised your child in Him, be assured that his word will not return void. Heterosexuality is not the solution to homosexuality. Some people struggle with all manner of sin for many years of their lives, these are heavy crosses to bear. Do not add anymore to that cross.
14. What wisdom does she have for church leaders?
Remember that homosexuality is a sin, and so is homophobia. Keep these in balance. Keep the gloves off.
15. How does she balance truth and love?
Be frank, be candid. Conversion does not mean belief in Jesus. Even the demons believe in Jesus, and it sent them straight to hell. Belief and faith are evident through fruit, and the fruit in a Christian life is the fruit of repentance. If you have somebody at church who is an adherent to your church and they cherish sin in their heart, then go tell them (love- faithful are the wounds of a friend). You have to draw the line because the name and testimony of Jesus Christ are at stake.
If you go to church, is the church there to coddle you? To woo you? Is your worship so that you can hear “atta boy”? The worship of God is there as a means of grace to give glory to God that He deserves.
Saturday:
16. What is your take-a-way and why?
Wow! This was a hard topic, indeed!
I am reminded once again that it is not good vs. bad works that send us to hell- it is rejection of Christ and his atoning sacrifice for my sins and his lordship over my life. Whether it be greed or homosexuality, it comes down to the sin beneath the sin, which is idolatry. It is letting self be in control, be lord of my life, the “captain of my soul”.
Thank you, Dee, for your leadership and your courage to tackle these 3 hard questions. The discussions have helped me be more grounded in truth and how to balance it with love.
Thanks, Bing. And good for Ruth!